FB pintail question

[6drakes]

Before I start I'm not complaining or saying that their too expensive,or that I'll never buy any but. Why are the full body pintails so high priced compared to the fb mallard. I'm sure there is a logical explanation and I am just wondering what it is. When tom posted that they would be about80 bucks a four pack I wasn't to alarmen then I started doing the math, 240 smackers a dozen thats as much as a doz. fb honkers! Why? there is only one body style therefore one mold versus 6 or 8 molds for the mallards. there are also two different paint schemes for the mallards(hens and drakes). so why are the pintails so much more? Again just wondering. for a guy who just wants to add a four pack or two for there water sets its not that big a deal but I was looking at a couple dozen and thats some serious coconuts considering I could buy 2 doz. honkers for that. The other ? I had was why are you doing four packs versus 6 packs? just curious. Again sorry if this sounds like bitchen but it just didn't make sense to me.

[Tom Matthews]

Is this a great country or what?

You can get the best full body Pintails ever made just because you (the consumers) ask for it, and we even provide you with an open public forum to ask the president of the company why they are going to cost so much! Hey that's what we are here for so, okay 6drakes, I will gladly explain the pricing:

1. These decoys are 22" long with fixed heads (non-removable) so the freight costs will be as high as a 6-pack carton of Full Body Mallards. The heads are fixed because we feel the decoy will be much more attractive and, therefore, effective with no visible connection line on the neck. There is no way to make a rotating head for full body Pintail drake because the white and crimson areas must be lined up always.

2. The number of Full Body Mallard molds we have cut has absolutely no bearing on the cost of our Full Body Pintails. What on Earth are you talking about? We have one body mold per style of Full Body Mallard, and we will have one mold for the Full Body Pintail. The cost of the mold never came into play here.

3. You can buy a dozen full body Canada goose decoys for $240 where exactly? The best advertised price I have seen was at $139.99/6-pack for GHG Hunter Series Canadas last season. The prices at which these decoys sell during retail sales events is another story, but I gave you our suggested retail price because Avery does not sell direct to the public. I am certain that there will be some short-sighted dealers out there that will offer these new decoys as low as $70/4-pack as soon as they arrive, and these will be the very same dealers that will call us crying for more three days after they got their first shipment. They will be out of luck.

4. You are assuming that the retail cost of one style and specie of decoy has any bearing on the retail cost of another. Would it surprise you if I told you that our Hunter Series Canada Goose Decoys are sold to our dealers at a much lower margin than we would normally make, and our dealers then sell them to consumers (you) at a lower margin than they should? This is called "entry level product pricing", and it is done as a strategic way for dealers to attract that category of consumers who would otherwise take their "lowest cost is always best" mentality and money to Wal-Mart or similar discounters. It's sad but we as consumers have become so selfish and greedy that we have come to expect the proverbial Cadillac for a Chevy price. Please hear me when I say this: there is no way I'm going to give our new Full Body Pintail away for one penny less than we deserve to make for such an awesome decoy - what our dealers do with it after they get it from us is totally up to them.

Maybe you did not catch my statement on this very subject in a previous thread, so I will copy and paste it here:

"To recap the specifics for the new GHG Full Body Pintails, they will be offered 4 drakes/carton with RealMotion for approximately $79.99. I realize that this is $20/bird so please don't start the conversation about how the price should be lower, lower, lower because that is not what this thread is about. I have done some research, and there is a choice when it comes to Full Body Pintails: Eberhart Decoys (www.eberhartdecoys.com) from California manufactures full body Pintails that retail for $99.99/dozen ($8.33 each) which is less than half the price of our FB Pintails. My old friend Tom Lucas, Jr. from Autolife Sporting Goods (www.autolifeinc.com) will ship them to you anywhere in the country so you might get in touch with him at 800/499-1004 if you are interested in a smaller but lower priced full body Pintail."

6drakes, I really think the Eberhart decoys might be what you are looking for because you can get two dozen for $200 vs. the $410 - $480 you will have to spend for two dozen GHG Full Body Pintails. I offered this information for anyone who felt the price I quoted for our new FB Pintails was too high for their tastes so I am curious why I needed to come back two days later and explain all of this. But…that's what we are here for as I said before so I hope my explanation above is acceptable because it is 100% accurate and all I have to offer.

Oh, and the reason we decided to offer the FB Pintails in 4-packs is that our Territory Managers polled many of our top dealers, and there was overwhelming support for 4 drakes/carton vs. 6.

Thanks!

Tom

[Brobones]

Well said, Tom. I will be in line for my 4 pack, will there be both feeders and active??

[6drakes]

Tom, thanks for the reply. It was a little snide but thanks anyway. Apparently you did not read the part of my post concerning the fact that I wasn'nt saying that they were TOO expensive or that I didn't want to buy any. I was just curious thats all. I guess you have issues with that sorry to ruffle your feathers. No Ebharts are not perfect for me, I like what I've see of GHG so far. I think that its gonna be awesome. I also could care less about how much money you guys make on hunter series, fb geese pintails, or blind bags. Your kids gotta eat to. I know all about markups and entry level pricing. I have owned my own buisness for 13 years and run a huge sales organization. I really don't care what percentage your markup is because you folks make a good product that I would buy regardless. I asked a simple Question and you answered it with the comments about it being a one piece decoy and shipping costs ect. that's all I was curious about. Just like I could care less if the pinnies were sold in 2 packs or 14 packs, I didn't know you polled your top dealers so I was just curious about the reason you went with 4 versus 6. Again, thank you for the reply. I know that you guys get bashed on here alot and you get sick of it but don't get so defensive when a loyal customer asks a simple question.

Oh yeah one more question. Will the rester and Sleeper fb mallards have motion bases or did you come up with something else?

[oltcutdown]

I have a question on this as well. What decoy bag are you suggesting using on the FB Pintails? I have 2 of the regular 12 slot bags for Mallards/blacks.

[Tom Matthews]

6drakes,

I suggest you read my answer to your question again and then read your response to me....did you say I was "defensive"? Come now….

My mother always said, "If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen", and I think that is a good way of describing how one should approach an open forum. If you come on here and yell "fire!" in a crowded theatre, then we are forced to react. I have always been of the opinion that we must put a knife in the heart of any potential problems before they can get started, and I see a guy who questions the price of a brand new decoy before the mold is even opened as a potential problem. I answered your question to its fullest extent which is 100% more than you would EVER get from even the lowest rung customer service representative from every other decoy manufacturer on Earth. So how is it that I am the problem here? I would ask you to consider the fact that Avery is not some massive corporation without a soul - it is a small and struggling company made up of guys just like you who bust their butts 24/7 to bring the best and most innovative waterfowling products to the market....and for what? So we can have our product pricing questioned as if we do not have a right to make a living? You said a mouthful several times when you stated, "I don't care" about this, and "I don't care" about that. Well I do care, and that's why I do what I do every single day and ask our guys to do the same. If you don't care what margins we make, then why did you ask why the FB Pintails were "so high priced" compared to the FM Mallards in front of everyone on the World Wide Web? I suppose it's easy to come back now and say "I don't care" because you feel you were talked down to by me. You were not talked down to sir, but you were given an explanation that was equivalent to the question that you raised. If you were offended, I apologize. I was offended by your question as well as your response, but I ask for no apologies because I do not know you, and I should know better that to make something personal out of what is strictly business.

I would like to say again that we do not know each other personally so I would ask that you not take any of this personally. I have been in awe for years of how a man can come on a forum and, with total anonymity, and make any statement he wishes but is the first to become outraged at the tone of the response he gets. I hope you will consider this. I will consider my tone as well and continue to try my best to use a more positive tone even when I am very angry and frustrated.

6drakes, you stated that you are a loyal customer, and I hope you know that everyone at Avery values your opinions greatly and appreciates every penny you have every spent on our products. We hope you will continue to choose Avery and GHG products, but we fully expect you to choose the products that make you happiest based on cost and performance. The fact that there are choices out there forces us to try to be better every day – frankly we love competition. We might not be able to always give you the lowest cost (as I explained fully in my original post), but we will strive to give you the most cutting edge and innovative products with the highest quality we can produce. I think that you will find that our prices have always been and will always be fair, and I hope that means something to you.

Truce?

Tom

[6drakes]

tom,

Yes truce, sent you a PM. thank you.

I am still wondering if the full body mallard resters and sleepers are on motion bases. I don't know why I'm so worried but curiosity killed the cat you know.
I guess its just an itch that needs scratching.